Plenty of room for Shaq to run around and catch foxes here in NW Connecticut - also, I can't remember the last time a helicopter flew over tracking gang activity. It was a good day...I didn't have to use my AK.

1 hour 40 minutes to NYC - not bad for peace of mind and quiet.

If it is not too presumptuous I'd like to make a push for Tujunga (north of Glendale). Moved there in '01 and have been happy ever since.

Prices have gone up since then but I have seen a number of house rentals (with yards) lately. Plus you can be near the coveted La Cresenta / Canada schools, the ones near the border of that district (still LAUSD) are rated pretty good.

Quiet, lots of parks but there are Coyotes...

I've lived in Highland Park for th elast three years and although we're in a relatively nice pocket, we're on our way out. The gunfire and police helicopters become much more alarming when you've got a little one (our guy is 5 months).

The greater Portland area is nice, especially if you're willing to look at the suburbs. (we got our small house and almost an acre on the river for $105,000 about 8 years ago). Of course, I wouldn't want any Portland readers to know I'm encouraging more of 'those Californians' to move here.

It's all so very Day of the Locust. L.A. is a siren, a beguiling seductress. Get past the great weather, though, and there's just not a whole lot of there there. Great place to visit, not so great a place to live long term. And it's such a driving city, too, which doesn't foster the kind of urban scene you seem to be fond of. Missing Persons was right: nobody walks in L.A.

Because you will probably make the same money irrespective of where you live, if I were you I'd look for a place with a lower cost of living, which is also likely to be safer. Have you sussed out Boise? ;)

You'll find a decent place someday, everyone who isn't wealthy lives in a shit hole when they first move here.

If you want a yard you probably will need to consider the valley, or somewhere closer to OC, though. But I have seen 2 bedroom apartments with decent but small personal yards in the $1500 range before. Try to take your time looking and just drive around (or bike around as I did) neighborhoods you like and call every for rent sign you see. The best places don't advertise, I think.

Whatever you do, don't move to fucking Portland. Or if you do, first get in a time machine and go back to 1992 and move to Seattle, then at some point move to Austin again, and then move to Portland in 2007 so you can get the trifecta of the great, white destination cities that coolness ultimately ruins.

I can't make a case for where I live. Well actually I can. It's an awesome place to have kids, the school system doesn't fuck you over, and the housing is ridiculously low. I'm not lying when I say that my husband and I are renting a three bedroom (one bath) house with a huge yard for 475 a month. Of course it is rural Illinois. I live in Macomb a college town that somehow gets missed by all the tornadoes. I'm serious, the last one was in 2000.

*cough* Larchmont Village *cough*

I don't understand that Portland comment. I have never been to Austin but I think Portland and Seattle are both great. I've been all around the nation and pretty much had a blast every place that I HAVE been, we have a great country here. But in the end, I wouldn't want to LIVE anywhere but the Pacific Northwest. I mean, come on...$1500 a month for a "2 bedroom apartment with a decent but small personal yard." That's more than my mortgage payment for a 3 bedroom, 2 bath house that I designed myself with a loft office and cool rope ladder that goes up to my daughters future 'fort space'. Not quite as cool as helicopters flying overhead searching for the escaped convict from last months gang shooting I know but you work with what you got.

As far as cities go, coolness is what you make it, you can live anywhere and find cool stuff going on. If you think Seattle, Portland and Austin have all been ruined by coolness, I hope to never become so 'uber-cool' that I agree...I'd much rather have fun.

I wonder if Clambone would have anything to say about it?

I highly recommend Topanga.

Meth sucks!

But lots more $ will be coming your way in about six months when Elijah's in public and free school instead of preschool.

Last action hero to the rescue: http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-gangs6mar06,0,4864598.story?coll=la-home-headlines rel="nofollow"

The Portland comment comes from not being able to go a day, for the last year or so, without hearing someone describe Portland as the best place to live in the world. I'm sure it is nice, I know it somewhat, but I'm guessing it's probably got just a few years left until it changes dramatically. I don't know Austin but I've been told it was cool/is cool but now there's too many freaking people and it's not the same. Seattle I know because I lived there before there were any condos and left when the first few were going up. Every neighborhood looks like the last and are basically interchangable, where 10-15 years ago they were distinct. Personally there's nothing there for me now because the difference between Coffee Messiah and B&O and Starbucks isn't enough to keep me interested. I love the cascades, but a condo and latte city with 7 months of rain a year ain't worth it. But that's me. I liked it OK before the consequences of its popularity because it changed a lot.

I just have a beef with the great white hopes that pop up every decade or so. After Portland it'll be... I dunno. Somewhere very white. Educated twenty and thirtysomethings want "culture", they want things to do, places to hang out, they want a routine that feels like they're really living, and medium-sized, mostly white cities fit the bill because you can still get a job as a barista and pay half the rent, and one cuban restaurant across town qualifies as diversity. They can't absorb too many people though until it changes and usually not for the better. Things smooth out, more money chases after the same demographics and you get stuck with a yuppified city. But the myth still remains. My brother, who loves Seattle, doesn't really see a difference. In fact it's better now because people are more alike than ever. He can go to any part of the city and hang out with people just like him. There's something odd about that to me. It's sort of a subconscious liberal version of fleeing to the suburbs and I see the same sort of subtle contempt pop up. You know, the having your own house vs. gangs outside and helicopters overhead. My bro makes the same argument and the implication is the same- there's something wrong with with having a kid and not living in a house with a yard in some starbuck city. It's oranges and apples to me.

Being stuck in one of LA's crappy neighborhoods for a while isn't necessarily a reason to flee to somewhere that isn't the center of the entertainment industry but does have a cool corner coffee shop called Zutro's that has killer cinnamon rolls and a cute barista with pink hair named Gwen and everyone looks the same and dresses the same and in the next neighborhood the barista is named Melody. LA is a totally different thing from Portland or Seattle or wherever. All I'm saying is it gets better and if a person's here for the entertainment industry, it's totally worth it.

The Valley, she beckons.

For breaking the lease, can you find a subletter?

The Valley, she beckons.

For breaking the lease, can you find a subletter?

Tim, it seems like the reason they want to "flee" their neighborhood is not "to have a cool corner coffee shop" or go to a city that's more "yuppified," but rather to protect their son from nearby gunfire and drug busts.

Tim,
For someone who has never lived in Austin, you sure have a lot of negative opinions. Seems to me that you should gain a little experience before you go spewing from the mouth. As for Seattle, I have never lived there, but I have visited several times. Considering a large portion of the city is Asian American, your "white" argument is lacking. Maybe you should get your pretentious head out of your ass and be a little more open to the world.
As for Neal, I hope you find a safe place to raise your son that does not hinder your creativity and personality...or his, for that matter.

Rural is the new urban is the new suburban. Sorry, I couldn't help myself. I love how often Neal's real life problems degrade into Hipster posturing. Occupational hazard, I suppose.

I'm not sure what your price ceiling is, but I'm pretty sure that you'll find under $2500/month in Eagle Rock.

amy- you misread or didn't read what I wrote. bekah- one sentence on austin saying "I've been told..." Come on, that's not a lot. And it isn't even my opinion. The Seattle stuff I stand behind though, especially how it's super-white. Because it is. Whitey-white, white.

Seriously though, Neal's talking about middle class issues, middle class ideals, and all anyone can ever offer is "move away from LA to this college town/super-white city/rural suburb, with the not-so-subtle intimation that there's something wrong and pathetic with living in a place like LA when Portland/Raliegh/Seattle/etc. is available. There's something fucked up about that and I can't quite put my finger on it. Clearly Neal needs a new neighborhood, duh, but LA isn't a vast carpet of hell. And why does he have to move in the first place? How does a gang get so entrenched that an injuction has to be passed? How does that happen? How many years, and where did it start? I dunno, the whole "flee to this medium-sized white town and pretend it's got as much going on as a fucked up place like LA or Chicago or NY" just rubs me the wrong way. And the layers of 'you're doing your child wrong' guilt trips laid on top of that... my opinion is firmly negative: That's fucked up.

What's so fucking great about LA? One suggestion I'll make is to make a list. So far I've only heard reasons to leave LA or at least the neighborhood. What are the reasons to stay. Personally I've never been impressed with the place but if Neal thinks that it's worth his life, time, taxes etc than fine.
ps. I'm not selling the rural is the new urban bullshit. Rural is rural anyway you slice it. Yes we have quiet and stars at night. There are places where there is nothing for miles and the sky meets the ground in what's called a horizon, city folk. However we have methlabs and rednecks and Wal-Mart. Like anyplace there are the pros and cons and whereever you choose to live your life the pros must outweigh the cons or life will suck. Ok I've said my peace and ranted the rant.

I believe the "coyotes" Elijah was referring to were of the human smuggler ilk as opposed to the Wile E. dog variety. If that was his intent, he's got a solid point. I am sure there are coyotes in your hood.

Everyone relax. I'm living here because this is where the work is for me right now. Also, I have a lot of family around...I just need to find a better neighborhood, which L.A. DOES have in abundance.

Neal, i'm not going to get into it in detail on your comment board, especially because its only 8:16am and I have not yet had coffee or breakfast -- however, here's some quick things to consider:

1) Did you feel your neighborhood was getting more dangerous BEFORE you saw that report about the injunction agaisnt this allgeged meth gang?

2) Don't believe what you are getting from the LA Times and the City Attorney's office, this is part of renewed "war on gangs" that has been going on for the past month.

3) If this alleged Highhland Park gang got hit with an injunction then it means that they have been in your neighborhood since the day you moved in, the gang has gotten more "dangerous" -- it is just part of a new "strategy" on the part of the city (actually it is the same old tactics in a brand new package).

4) With the exception of about 3 neighborhoods, helicopters are a presence in every LA neighborhood. It is just the way it is 'round here. When we used to live in Bev/Fairfax area helicopters would literally fly over and the searchlights would sweep through our apartment - ours was not a dangerous neighborhood -- Fortress LA, baby!

5) Of course, we techinically don't even really live in LA so easy for us to say!

(p.s. Civil injunctions are constitutional under "nuisance" laws -- however studies have shown that they don't make matters any better or worse, at this point they're just political showpieces).

ashley- It's not that LA's so fucking great, it's just not a sucking void of poo, that's all. All the things that you hear suck about it, suck about it. But then also there's always something new to see or do, there's always someplace different and unexplored within a 1/2 hour drive, apart from the requisite china town it's got like 7 other "towns", cool big-city stuff like retail/wholesale "districts", great beaches, great weather, mountains aren't too far away, but the biggest, best thing, for people who care, is the vast reservoir of talent here. If that's important to you for some reason then you put up with the suck parts of the city because it's simply unparalled the amount of talented writers, performers, etc. that are here. Not to mention it's one of the two cities where it's realistic to make a living in the entertainment industry.

And then eventually you land a sweet apartment in W. Hollywood with all the safe gay men and you hardly have to deal with the sucky parts anyway.

Sounds like the fun you had in Alternadad all over again.
I think it's best to pack up shop and move on.

Nothing is more important that the family's safety.

That's part of the reasoning whether we decide to move to downtown Nashville, or out a bit...we'll probably end up out a bit, but I have the same problems with that as you do.

I want bars and cafes walking distance, and not in some stripmall. Sigh.

Dave

I've lived in a lot of places but I've always been kind of sheltered by my parents. They were "professional students" for the majority of my childhood and we managed to live, for the most part, in student housing.

I've been to LA and have not seen it at it's best. There is this shallowness and fakeness about it that I don't like. I hope that someday I change my mind about it.

I think I'd rather have space to think and beautiful sunsets for the time being. Strangly enough you can find both in rural Illinois.

As an aside, I'll be graduating and going on to get an MFA. So I'll have to leave my little town and adjust to (and probably like) living in a city. I've come to the conclusion that I've got to go all the way with city living. I wont put up with suburia.

J:

I was a reporter in Chicago for many years, so I know perfectly well that "gang wars" are usually just a PR stunt, and bad public policy to boot. That said, we have been noticing more shady activity around here. Lots of speeding white vans without rear windows....

At least the graffiti is pretty.

There's shallowness and fakeness everywhere though. I mean, there's nothing quite like the freakshow you can catch on rodeo drive, but to me "fakeness" has to do more with propriety, and I've found the rigors of what you need to do to fit in more stringent pretty much everywhere else I've lived, from population 500 to 500,000, largely because there's just fewer options.

You know, the number of wealthy, beautiful people social gatherings I've attended has been zero. It's not like you have to hang out with Paris wannabe types just because they're within a 10 mile radius.

Eagle Rock was livable/affordable ten years ago, even though the walk to Super A Foods made me nervous after dark. If we'd have stuck it out maybe that mythical West Hollywood apartment would have been ours. Good luck to you and yours. And three cheers for Carpinteria.

While I find Paris Hilton and her ilk revolting that's not what I found fake about LA. I guess there's just something unreal about the whole place that is disconcerting.
I'm finding it hard to peg down what it was. I've found it in other places too like Florida where I spent 8 years in the land of strip malls and jungle. Not that I can really compare the two it's just the same uneasy feeling that I get when I go back to the town I grew up. Ya know, it's called Jupiter, Florida for a reason.
All that said I'm sure that there are oasises (?!?) of beauty in LA just like you can forget all that's bad about Jupiter at 5 am on the beach.

Two words: New Orleans. Yes, you've heard of the crime problem post-Katrina on the news, but its localized, for the most part. That doesn't make it acceptable, but I just want to make it clear that New Orleans has a number of culturally diverse areas where corner cafes and questionable joints coexist with retro shops and bistros. The public school system, historically, has been bad, but with the establishment of charter schools and a spark in national interest, hopefully things will continue to improve. Unique "shotgun" houses, especially those needing renovation since the storm, are affordable, and this place is worth the effort. I've been born and raised here, all of my 35 years, and I am raising my children here. New Orleans is both very "southern" and very cosmopolitan. It is a city of juxtapositions and excesses. You can call it whatever you want, but you can never call it boring. And as a writer myself, it is endlessly inspiring. I would be very surprised to hear that you haven't at least visited. The music, the food, the mayhem that is Mardi Gras ... All I know about you and your family is what you've written, but you seem suited to appreciate my cities' eccentricities.

I wonder if the Highland Park gang got some sort of prize for being the 50th gang to get an injunction.

Like when a guy is the 1,000th customer at the grocery store and the comp him a year of groceries?

Lynn,

Isn't New Orleans wonderful? The only big cities I've ever lived in are London and Auckland, so I can't suggest any U.S. places w/o sounding like a jackass. But of all the U.S. cities I've visited, no place holds a candle to New Orleans. I had a layover in LA and there were two live police chases in that time. DFW is forgettable. Houston is a nightmare. St. Louis has a bit of character, but no. Chicago had a 25 degree change (for the worse) in the middle of the day in May. Nashville has promise with the record industry starting to migrate there from LA. But New Orleans has no equal. It never will.

At least they have better graffiti skills than the ner-do-wells around our neighborhood. We got our garage door splashed, Jackson-Pollack-like, with red, green and black paint. Lest you think this is a very organized outfit, we were thankful we aren't the owners of the garage with "HUMP ME" written on it.

Why don't you move the family to San Marino? The only white vans there belong to the gardners.

San Marino would be lovely, and then we would all live in a studio apartment together.

The cost of living has gone up so much it's really difficult to find a nice place to live. My husband and I needed to move out of state just to start our lives...buy a home and raise our family. We looked in Northern California, Portland, Seattle, and Austin and a bunch of other cities. Most of them are really great places. We picked Atlanta because of the neighborhoods and diversity. It's a great city and more affordable for us than anything on the West Coast. And Portland is a really nice city but it's not diverse enough. Our neighborhood is going through gentrification. It has some moments. The neighborhood association is really bringing the community together and I feel welcomed. i loved California and living there but it's just not the "promised land" if you can't afford it.

I understand the "fear" of living in LA, but as someone who would love to buy a house in Highland Park or a loft Downtown, I can't help but feel the "nice place" Neal and Renee and the rest of the anti-LA posters are looking for are "non-brown" areas of cities with neghborhood associations to keep out the riff raff. That's why I suggested San Marino, Mr. Pollack. My kid is due in July, and I can't wait to take it out and about. Granted, I do live in Pasadena, and Downtown living often includes gentrification and the like, but damnit, do we really want our kids living yuppified lives in the suburbs, where the only thing edgy is their iPod? I hope not. That's why the wife and I have been looking for ways to get either back into LA-proper. We may stay in Pasadena, but I doubt we'll be able to buy in the type of neighborhood we rent in (which, by the way, is "nice" but has its more than fair share of helicopters and sirens). Shouldn't "Alterna-parenting" be more than just trying to replicate our middle class childhoods with more tatoos and pot than our parents?

Anyone who reads this site, or my work in general, knows that I am not looking for some sort of suburban safe zone for my kid. And god knows I don't shelter him from "brown" people, whoever those are. But certain aspects of middle-class life--a backyard, a safe street on which to play, neighborhoods relatively free of public prostitution--become more important once the kid is born. Just you wait...and good luck!